Jump to content
Lunar

Zeny Zeny Zeny

Zeny... Zeny? Zeny!  

130 members have voted

This poll is closed to new votes
  1. 1. Are you happy with how it is?

    • Enable Thanatos Tower Farming again
      30
    • Dont reduce HTF buillon prices
      37
    • Enable Thanatos and keep HTF with official buillon price
      57
    • Dont enable thanatos and nerf buillon price
      27


Recommended Posts

Quote

Alright, this doesn't go anywhere. 

Instead of resolving it, it spams my DM full. 

-----------------------------------------------------

There will come a series of different zeny sinks in the next weeks.
One of which will be a Sealed Card Envelope which will also be available through other means as promised previously, which means it will sink zeny that actually exists aswell as be an option for anyone else.


Poll will be closed and eventually re-opened in the future with better solutions.

 

Note 1: This poll was a way for me to hear what people think and feel regarding the zeny and how the economy went recently. Whether or not a poll get's implemented is still up to the staffs decision, it merely asks for the opinions of the people.

Note 2: I appreciate for your time and your concerns, you all also have mine. Which still strives to bring out the best in the server and the people and in some cases might be drastic measures at first but you might see what they mean or do.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Put a 5th option! Enable Thanatos and nerf HTF. I picked the 3rd option thinking that it was like this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually - option 3 is the best for all

thanatos was fast zeny but 1-2 parties max, while htf would allow same earn but solo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yuju! People with no idea what are the effects in the inflation of the server deciding how to destroy it!! 

What can go wrong? 

This is one of the very few things that should not be discussed with the users, (unless we want to destroy the thing).

Also, we need another zeny sinc mechanism imho.

Inflation went absurd with op bullions price in just 1 week, what can go wrong if we put it like that by default? 

Ofc people that has 2k bullion in the storage is going to vote for that... 

These poll should have been done prior to the thing, not afterwards, and even then I don't think it is a great idea to ask.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Lunar said:

Actually - option 3 is the best for all

thanatos was fast zeny but 1-2 parties max, while htf would allow same earn but solo

LET ME REDO MY VOTE!! D:

Tho, why not making HTF gold and bullion official drop rate and enable Thana?

Edited by Aikan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gonna be honest, I don't even do HTF nor Thanatos. But to keep the economy & the new players going/a fair chance, I think it's best to just let HTF be & let Thana farming be a thing.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that, at least on Niflheim, the economy is kinda broken. Lots of people just throw away end gear and others sell them for 50-200m, there are no standard prices nor a demand for those items, a few exceptions are Limited ores, Gambler seal-like items (very dif to find), Moon Coins, MVP cards.

I highly suggest a economy overhaul, but that won't happen by nerfing farming spots, maybe rebalancing the prices.

Still, IMO there should be better way to recicle gear, reality is that most mid to late game stuff are worth 10z. Most shadow gear can't even be used before +7 and even if u go and think: "Well, i will just roll 3 of them and try to get a better one" u can't, because 5m for a box that destroys ur gear for a random one is WAY too much.

Even if it takes time, by categorizing the items by Tier you could reprice them and make use of them. You could Tier the item for difficult or demand, maybe both, but by taging a price at an item you could see a revamp on the economy and the grinding spots, therefore no need for closed farming spots (HTF, TT, Jupe, Geffenia, hello?).

 

  • Thanks 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Aikan said:

Put a 5th option! Enable Thanatos and nerf HTF. I picked the 3rd option thinking that it was like this.

the 1st option will be it, enable thanatos( and nerf htf(today patch))

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, shaolin said:

the 1st option will be it, enable thanatos( and nerf htf(today patch))

Sorry, me am retard.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The number that represents zeny is simply that, a number. There is no way to prevent this number from growing but disabling zeny gaining methods simply cuts the heels of new players and is something that should be avoided.

The only issue with high zeny amounts is that it becomes inconvenient to trade and hold that much zeny this could be solved with in-depth solutions such as raising zeny caps or allowing players to vend or buy from stalls using 17carat diamonds for example.

I am in favor of reintroducing Thanatos farming but also keeping HTF intact. This provides both a solo zeny grinding area as well as a communal one where players can interact more, which is in all honestly, a lot more fun.

If the amount of zeny becomes too cumbersome then we should make it less cumbersome, not prevent newer players from making it too.

  • Thanks 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's my take on the situation, and I'll try and lay out my thoughts step by step:
HTF created an insane amount of new zeny out of nothing.
HTF was so lucrative that it overtook many endgame activities (not all) with quasi no barrier of entry.
There was a massive inflation over the last few weeks.
(Inflation: much faster influx of newly created zeny without an equal amount of newly created items to counterbalance it. Zeny loses value at an alarming rate.)
Players that were active (whether farming directly or selling to farmers) made a lot of wealth.
Much of that wealth is in the form of raw zeny, since zeny never left the economy, it just moved hands.
Problem1: massive inflation makes trading tedious and incentivizes sitting on items instead of trading, or fast buy (low) and resale (high). Raw zeny in the bank quickly loses buying power. Every day you are losing money and you have to keep pace with the craziest of farmers just to have the same market power that you had the day before. IF YOU DONT UNDERSTAND THIS THOUGHT; READ IT AGAIN AND THINK ABOUT IT. THAT IS THE CORE PROBLEM HERE.
Also additional problems like zeny cap and zeny trading cap. It just gets cumbersome. Also it turned shining moon into a solo player game.
Solution1: Nerf HTF, stop further uncontrolled inflation. MUCH NEEDED. The only correct move in my opinion. (HTF should never have been 30m, but we cant turn back time)

Situation now:
New players dont have the option to farm HTF as efficiently anymore.
So now they have to compete for ressources in a market that has lots of old zeny, with their even lower income of new zeny.
They dont have much marketable value to offer (zeny, items they could farm that are of value to old players, etc).
Problem: New players dont only have to play catch up, they have to play catch up in a market that is stacked against them.
I predict the average newcomer will hit a wall when wanting to upgrade from grace set.

I 100% agree with raphat on this one. Many players are greedy and shortsighted beyond help. They lack the foresight, the education, the self-control, the market understanding, i dont know what it is.
It's like a drug high, you get lots of reward in a short term for - what you know is - an inappropriately low amount of effort. Think about three months down the line without HTF nerf, and prices keep rising. BSB have reached 20m, and we're at the same point we are with nerfed HTF today, 1.5 BSB per HTF. Except the prices just keep going more crazy, and keep rising. 6months down the line and BSB might have reached 60m. Half a BSB per HTF run. Try and understand what INFLATION means, in this context especially...

What we should talk about is how to get rid of the billions in the hands of the rich players today, in an effort to ease new players access to the game, without the destructive inflation of the last weeks.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Easy zeny sinks:
Add Sealed Envelope ( gives a random Sealed MvP Card which is bound to account ), the item that gets that card put in, cannot be traded / sold / vended / dropped / guild storaged until the card is removed for 1b zeny.

So even if everyone keeps making the zeny they do and more, it wouldnt cause anything to the market because the zeny would be sinked and normal mvp cards wouldnt be affected.

  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Look at those people voting "but mah zeny" and wanting every farming option without thinking about inflation.
Im sure MCs going from 600k to 1500k (in helheim's case) wasn't enough to warn you guys about inflation... good luck everyone on hel! The Abyss between new players and old players will be even bigger.

Gonna need some endgame sinks, like the envelope idea.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Munbalance said:

The number that represents zeny is simply that, a number.

Yes and no. The number is arbitrary. But the value relative to the items you're trading it for is not.

That relationship is a value judgement that players are making themselves and negotiating between each other.

Example right now. 9m zeny could be any other number, it's arbitrary. BSB is a refining item, with no inherent equivalent in zeny value, but a very defined utility (in refining). Everyone wants zeny, everyone sees the value in BSB.

The "market price" is the point where the desire of the BSB seller with the lowest desire to hold onto BSB with a high desire to trade it for zeny, and on the other hand the guy with the zeny that wants to buy BSB without overpaying intersect. Everyone gets the best deal possible. (which is btw the reason that fixed prices are delustional, ridiculous.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is totally a zeny sink issue and not a zeny issue.

Please just give us something worth spending zeny on for the more end game orientated people.

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How about a "SpecialBox" like the one for 1k Cash points just for idk 5m but with LOWER ammount of items? (Bsb,HD Ores,BBs, Etc NO MOON COINS!!!!)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Cgrez33 said:

People are so worried about makinga quick buck that they forget inflation is a thing.

 

People are worried about making quick buck cause other people sell their stuff 5 times more expensive than it should.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, luxaryro said:

 

with it, a +15 crimson weapon with 2 sealed drake will transform any physical class into a monster, atleast in pvp

sealed drake is not a kRO item, and would likely not be included even in Nif

that being said, pvp definitely needs a good looking at

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Btw it's not a sink issue at all 

The items are worth are equal to the time you spend farming for them and how many ppl can do the farm even if you spend 1B on a a sealed card

hypothetically if it takes me 1hour to farm a contaminated wanderer card which cost like 100m and need average gear to farm why would i sell it for a 100m after the change since getting that amount require low gear and less than 30min 

It's about how easy is the zeny is to get not about how much zeny is sinked

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×